all these posts about buying the fastest trainers.....

and what have I learned? nothing.

I keep thinking that buying the most expensive players in the list will ensure I get fast, but not necessarily the fastest, trainers.

Can someone tell me how I can be more sure of buying faster trainers? I have been playing for 20 seasons and still not sure...because I am not on here all the time and frankly, I'm really lazy when it comes down to it.

for example, I just bought a 19yo ST, $105M, 103Q. I just did a hard practice match and got 63 points.
I have had my 21yo AML/ML, $78.7M, 96Q. hard practice match got him 99 points, almost 1 skill point.
and finally my 21yo DL/DML, $75M, 96Q, hard practice match got him 90 points, almost 1 skill point.

Logic would say that the 19yo ST at $105M would train better but the other two players make that a lie.

Can someone educate me?

I keep hearing nordgen. These are players on the list from bot teams or teams that are nordeus made to make up numbers? These are the faster trainers?

Since value is not the best indicator, what is?

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Originally Posted by Sully

and what have I learned? nothing.

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LOL

The T11 truth is that nobody knows anything mate, we think that we know coz we profexonals with more than 30 seasons of history but we still having surprises :'D


To say something about what u ask and not about what u don't ask... LOL

Theres not a ratio that +value = more fast training in proggressive sense depending of the value. Here nothing is a guarantee.

And yea, better, better, better again, go for Nordgens.


The best indicator is the 6th sense, intuition. Too for MC's ST's the stats with the old team that have one player can be used, if not, young players, high value, if not, Nordgens, if not, go to the Top Scorers/rated page of your league and do an offer for some Top player, if not, cahneg all your team, if not, tank and go to the beach. If no beach swimmingpool LOL

I also want to know the equation to calculate training effectiveness. But probably this is not a simple logic that I can easily understand. Besides factors I know like age, market value, quality star levels, there may be other factors.

The fastest trainer of my level 15 team in this season is a 21 years old, low 5 star defender. His average training effectiveness in this season is the best in 3 seasons when star quality level are 5. Now he is the forth lowest market value player in the team (partially because he is one of oldest player). But his average training effectiveness is better than those younger, higher prized teammates in same star level.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sully

and what have I learned? nothing.

I keep thinking that buying the most expensive players in the list will ensure I get fast, but not necessarily the fastest, trainers.

Can someone tell me how I can be more sure of buying faster trainers? I have been playing for 20 seasons and still not sure...because I am not on here all the time and frankly, I'm really lazy when it comes down to it.

for example, I just bought a 19yo ST, $105M, 103Q. I just did a hard practice match and got 63 points.
I have had my 21yo AML/ML, $78.7M, 96Q. hard practice match got him 99 points, almost 1 skill point.
and finally my 21yo DL/DML, $75M, 96Q, hard practice match got him 90 points, almost 1 skill point.

Logic would say that the 19yo ST at $105M would train better but the other two players make that a lie.

Can someone educate me?

I keep hearing nordgen. These are players on the list from bot teams or teams that are nordeus made to make up numbers? These are the faster trainers?

Since value is not the best indicator, what is?

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Your 96Q players are 4* and ST is 5*... there is around 20% training speed difference... The fastest 4* trainers range is between 114% and 174% for training match set on hard (19-29% stretching set on normal)... Around 20% less than that when they reach 5*

Just checked... My goalie who had 19-29% range for normal stretching, now, as 5* player has range 14-23%... That is 84-138% for training match set on hard... So nether one of your players is the fastest... All 3 are fast trainers, but just average ones...

Short conclusion: we have to "pray" if we are buying/raising an expensive youth :rolleyes:

With patience all my Nordgens fasttrainers has turned to Nordgems, it is just a different timetable before performance peak, at least thats my experience :rolleyes:

Below level 16 you can be pretty sure that max value players are fast trainers. At level 16 you start hitting a value cap that increases only slightly per season and not enough to reflect a true 'training value'. From then on your chance of Max Value = fast trainer diminishes, afaik.

For example last Season the max value players I was buying at level 15 were 96m and the max value my players could achieve was 104m. This season the max value on TM is 104m and in my team the max value is 105m so far - no matter if my player is 5, 6 or 7* its still 105m and won't go much higher if at all. If there was not MV cap I reckon the Max Value on the TM would be around 108m. So already you can see that players whose value (if it reflected training) in the range 104-108m are all max value. (Although this should not have much of an effect on me yet.)

Next season this effect will be more pronounced. And Max Value will include a higher percentage of players than at previous levels....I assume it gets worse the higher you go (from what I've read) but I'm only level 16 and just hitting the cap.

But to your numbers firstly 18-21 is the youngster age range so you can expect fast trainers in that range to train similarly (given normal variation). We expect a decline in training when a player crosses an age range not, so far as I've seen, year on year. (We then also see a decline or increase in training rate as the stars go up or down respectively).

You can't tell anything from single or even a few training sessions unless you are lucky and you get a players highest rate and can compare. But as Wolfie indicates a 4* fastest trainer will achieve anything from 110'ish upwards and average around 140 for MP Hard.

Again as Wolfie says you'll then see a decline of around 20%, 25% and 33% as a 4* reaches 5, 6 & 7* respectively.

I've never recorded training rates across the age range so can't comment on that.

So the TL;DR response is Max Value for Q does indicate the training rate but the Value Cap begins to obscure the true training value of a player from level 16 onwards.....afaik because I can't be sure unti I've really seen it for myself. Max Value + NordGen will give you the best chance of getting a Fast Trainer im lowly o. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Steppenwolf

Your 96Q players are 4* and ST is 5*... there is around 20% training speed difference... The fastest 4* trainers range is between 114% and 174% for training match set on hard (19-29% stretching set on normal)... Around 20% less than that when they reach 5*

Just checked... My goalie who had 19-29% range for normal stretching, now, as 5* player has range 14-23%... That is 84-138% for training match set on hard... So nether one of your players is the fastest... All 3 are fast trainers, but just average ones...

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never said they were the fastest. If I get 100 or more points for hard practice match (HPM), they are keepers for the most part. anything less than 50 pts for HPM I start looking for a replacement.

you see, I dont waste tokens buying and selling players just because they are not the fastest trainers. I buy them for a purpose and if they are slow trainers, I will replace them at first opportunity. Otherwise, they last a season or two and get sold. But I dont immediately sell them and waste tokens.

Point is, I cant tell by age, value or quality if a player will give me that fast trainer aspect. I hear nordgens are fast trainers...how can I tell what a nordgen is?

You can tell by Value what isn't a fastest trainer and you can tell by age. Therefore Max Value etc still applies its just not 100% once you hit capped values.

NordGens are players generated to maintain a healthy TM that are sold by teams such as AC Happy, FC Flaky, Shifty AC, FC Weakly etc (similar to starting team names) which appear a few hours after daily reset. Pick the Max Value ones.

The only way you know if a player is actually a NordGen player is if you click on the Team name in the mail you get after buying him and it will say "....Information not available...."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sully

never said they were the fastest. If I get 100 or more points for hard practice match (HPM), they are keepers for the most part. anything less than 50 pts for HPM I start looking for a replacement.

you see, I dont waste tokens buying and selling players just because they are not the fastest trainers. I buy them for a purpose and if they are slow trainers, I will replace them at first opportunity. Otherwise, they last a season or two and get sold. But I dont immediately sell them and waste tokens.

Point is, I cant tell by age, value or quality if a player will give me that fast trainer aspect. I hear nordgens are fast trainers...how can I tell what a nordgen is?

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Clubs with generated names sell nordgens... AC Naughty, FC Hilarious, A.C. Lazy, F.C. Clumsy, etc. And they are more expensive than any other players u can find at auction... You will know player is a nordgen if morale and condition at 80% when you buy them...

Buffs is right. When you level up and the Values/Wages are the same for all players, you can't recognize a fast trainer.
There are at least 3 classes of nordgen.
The fast , over +100 in 3bars/practice
The good, round +80
The average +60
* those are avg numbers
** I never bought lower class but must be (as older age nordgens)
They are all from bot teams but have difference in their value.
In higher levels you can't recognize what "class" he is. You just buy him and test him.

I've been playing 25 seasons now and buying 18y nordgens good bad bad bad.......I've give up with them unless defenders or gk. I now look for 21+ yo players who have good stats for previous team.good assists and man of match then you know for sure if they are always in the action.ive had too many players that seem good but you never see there name on commentary.keep them couple season then move them on at 26 yo.

Yeah, training speed does not always equal a good player. If you get the hot prospects you can at least get an idea of their performance.
I like training players but on my alt teams I do look at the slightly older guys, an they are easier to get for one Token.