Nordeus has changed game-engine so counterformations dont work?

in the last two weeks I've lost using the 4-4-2 narrow diamond and the 4-5-1 V vs inferior teams using 4-4-2.
Today I played a guy who used 4-3-3. He was of course not watching the game and in the beginning his MC gets injured badly. His team was also a lot worse than mine; his best player was 5 star less than my best.

I use 4-1-4-1 that usually works pretty well against the 4-3-3. But in this game he won with 5-0 and absolutely dominated the game in terms of chances, despite me having 55-60% possession. Simply amazing.

It seems obvious to me that Nordeus have tweaked the game-engine so that proven counter-formations dont work anymore. This is pretty bad imo and I dont really get why they felt the need to change something that was already working. Right now, it's just way too random.

4-4-2 did caused me problem recently .. so yeahh could be a match engine, although i don't think 4-4-2 narrow diamond or 4-5-1 V is counter .. i will go with flat 451

people have been saying for ages that the 4-4-2 ND (aka 4-1-2-1 ND) is the mother of all counterformations to the 4-4-2 though :)

Try the 4-4-2 "wide" diamond istead of the 4-4-2 narrow diamond.... Also, the 4-5-1 V seems to be overrated

WTF .. lost again facing same stupid same team playing with 442.. am 37 avg and he is 27 .. he didn't even watch his games!! i tried many formations.. i got 65% possession and yet i lost home 1-3 .. exact copy of the first game !! WTF
i played many game engines before but this one is by far the most stupid one, he score his chances and my players free to shoot many times and decided to shoot near post or into the crowd like 7-8 times !!
leaving the stupid game, going back to FM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwanko07

WTF .. lost again facing same stupid same team playing with 442.. am 37 avg and he is 27 .. he didn't even watch his games!! i tried many formations.. i got 65% possession and yet i lost home 1-3 .. exact copy of the first game !! WTF
i played many game engines before but this one is by far the most stupid one, he score his chances and my players free to shoot many times and decided to shoot near post or into the crowd like 7-8 times !!
leaving the stupid game, going back to FM

Give me some screen´s :p

i think i will get back that 4-1-2-1-2 narrow diamond

You're not supposed to use counter formations against much inferior teams. What's the point of countering a formation you can already beat without countering? As what someone said on here, you only counter a formation if you feel you cannot control the game. Mainly used against teams who are better or close in quality.

Tip of the day: If you are playing against a much inferior team, use your own formation. You'll get better results.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dv8r

You're not supposed to use counter formations against much inferior teams. What's the point of countering a formation you can already beat without countering? As what someone said on here, you only counter a formation if you feel you cannot control the game. Mainly used against teams who are better or close in quality.

Tip of the day: If you are playing against a much inferior team, use your own formation. You'll get better results.

Very true, whats the point of countering a weaker team ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by hullabaloo

in the last two weeks I've lost using the 4-4-2 narrow diamond and the 4-5-1 V vs inferior teams using 4-4-2.
Today I played a guy who used 4-3-3. He was of course not watching the game and in the beginning his MC gets injured badly. His team was also a lot worse than mine; his best player was 5 star less than my best.

I use 4-1-4-1 that usually works pretty well against the 4-3-3. But in this game he won with 5-0 and absolutely dominated the game in terms of chances, despite me having 55-60% possession. Simply amazing.

It seems obvious to me that Nordeus have tweaked the game-engine so that proven counter-formations dont work anymore. This is pretty bad imo and I dont really get why they felt the need to change something that was already working. Right now, it's just way too random.

2 things you should keep in mind.
1)Don't depend on the counter formation threads so much. most of them are a few months old. nordeus is changing the game engine constantly.
2) many of these advices are crap. why narrow diamond is so good against 4-4-2? of course you have the advantage of the amc and the 2 strikers against only 2 dc but if the opponent focus playing through the flanks with red arrows to his wingers then you also have a problem. why 4-5-1 v is good against 4-4-2? your aml/amr are blocked from his dr/dl and your lonely striker is between 2 dc. whats the purpose to use dmc against 4-4-2?
dv8r is absolutely right. put your best 11 in if you are much better.
the answer to your question about the game engine is that they havent change it yet. but they are going to as they do every season for the last week. that period are happening crazy results. i guess they must have a button ''random results'' which they press to the maximum in order to give some spice to the game.

The game engine is the same... just because you lost a game it dosen't mean they changed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PricopGeorgeCătălin

The game engine is the same... just because you lost a game it dosen't mean they changed.

of course. but when your undefeated scout team loses 2-3 games of the last 10 and struggles to win the other against 4 star teams then something is wrong. coincidence that it happens every season? do you forget how many people complain about random results of every seasons last week?

Quote:

Originally Posted by gkassimis

of course. but when your undefeated scout team loses 2-3 games of the last 10 and struggles to win the other against 4 star teams then something is wrong. coincidence that it happens every season? do you forget how many people complain about random results of every seasons last week?

Isn't it always the case that players will complain if they loose some matches? Also in RL you can't win all the time, even if you have the better squad.
In this case, maybe try another formation or tactics. After all, it will be an engine who calculates if you have better chances then the opponent.

I don't ever bother using counter formation, I just play with my formation whatever team I come across.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealM

I don't ever bother using counter formation, I just play with my formation whatever team I come across.

Thats the spirit!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poker-32

Isn't it always the case that players will complain if they loose some matches? Also in RL you can't win all the time, even if you have the better squad.
In this case, maybe try another formation or tactics. After all, it will be an engine who calculates if you have better chances then the opponent.

when you have 20 wins for the league scoring 4-5 goals each game, you have won all your cl and cup games and suddenly you can't win deserted teams with half your quality then there is a problem. i am not talking about losing 1-2 games. i am talking of losing 3-4 games out of 10 and win the other very difficult.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gkassimis

many of these advices are crap. why narrow diamond is so good against 4-4-2?

because loads of people have experienced how the 4-4-2 narrow diamond basically always used to easily beat the 4-4-2 flat :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PricopGeorgeCătălin

The game engine is the same... just because you lost a game it dosen't mean they changed.

i wish you would actually read my initial post in this thread. It had nothing to do about me losing a game but rather how it happened. There's a big difference

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealM

I don't ever bother using counter formation, I just play with my formation whatever team I come across.

i used to play classic 4-4-2 until level 5 no matter what the opponents formation was. after that level i had to counter formations or stay empty handed. it works only if you have at least 1 star higher quality than the others. otherwise you will fail eventually.

I know what kind of frustration you may have....
But who knows what the sollution for this matter may be.
Did it happend just this season?

[QUOTE=hullabaloo;51905]because loads of people have experienced how the 4-4-2 narrow diamond basically always used to easily beat the 4-4-2 flat :)

i followed these advices and they failed me often. now i am counting only in my experience. do you understand my logic why 4-4-2 narrow diamond is not always effective against 4-4-2? for me if the 2 teams are equal it's 50-50 to win because both formations have disadvantages that the other formation can exploit. it's like a fight between an one handed man and one leg man. who do you think can win?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poker-32

I know what kind of frustration you may have....
But who knows what the sollution for this matter may be.
Did it happend just this season?

it's happening every season the last week and not only to me but to many people. there are many complains. this season hasn't started yet.

i am sure it will happen towards the end, it always does. many league leaders will lose game miraculously so that the league will become more even and people will feel a need to buy tokens and use them to make the team better for the end of the league.

I don't know if Nordeus has changed the engine but for sure something is different.

In my league there are 2-3 teams with 21 to 24 quality that keep on winning all their matches.
My team is 34 quality and I have the same chanches to win 8-0, to draw or to lose 0-1.

Yesterday, in cup quarter-finals, I lined up a defense made by 4 players 6* and one 7*, all with SA.
The mentality was defensive and I had no red arrows.
And, as often happens, I conceded a gol (to a 4* MC).

During the last season I used to win all matches with 4-5 gol margin.

It seems the "random factor" has been increased.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dv8r

You're not supposed to use counter formations against much inferior teams. What's the point of countering a formation you can already beat without countering? As what someone said on here, you only counter a formation if you feel you cannot control the game. Mainly used against teams who are better or close in quality.

Tip of the day: If you are playing against a much inferior team, use your own formation. You'll get better results.

he is right...You always have to rely on your own strengh and formation...
I always play like this:

-----------ST-----------
AML----------------AMR
-------MC-----MC------
----------DMC----------
DL-----DC-----DC-----DR
-----------GK-----------

OR when I need an extra offensive punch I'll remove the DMC and add a AMC:

-----------ST-----------
AML------AMC------AMR
-------MC-----MC------
DL-----DC-----DC-----DR
-----------GK-----------

And during the match I will make adjustments if I feel necessary.
Like removing a DC and adding a ST if the opponent is playing with one striker

4-1-2-2-1 and 4-2-2-2 are the only ones I use and I wont change them just because I saw a team that am afraid of and use a counter formation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSH

he is right...You always have to rely on your own strengh and formation...
I always play like this:

-----------ST-----------
AML----------------AMR
-------MC-----MC------
----------DMC----------
DL-----DC-----DC-----DR
-----------GK-----------

OR when I need an extra offensive punch I'll remove the DMC and add a AMC:

-----------ST-----------
AML------AMC------AMR
-------MC-----MC------
DL-----DC-----DC-----DR
-----------GK-----------

And during the match I will make adjustments if I feel necessary.
Like removing a DC and adding a ST if the opponent is playing with one striker

Same, the only difference is I remove DMC and make it ST.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealM

Same, the only difference is I remove DMC and make it ST.

I only use the DMC when opponent is using an AMC, if not I'll remove the DMC for a AMC or ST.