Captain, oh my Captain

This is a test for my friend Amane, who is insisting that with Captainship we can manipulate/influence our team.
Personally, I don't believe it (99%) but as Fox Mulder saying in X-Files, I want to believe.
Amane is presenting more theories about captain but non example, so I 'm offering my second team (which I have anyway for experiments) to follow his theories.
This is Artemis FC (it's a Greek female name, the ancient Goddess of forest and hunting, Diana later for the Romans).
Project
The team

Attachment 43257

The target : After loosing last two seasons the opportunity to won the treble (lv2 I lost in Cups semi/won CH.L., lv3 won the Cup/lost in CH.L. final), I decided to stay in the same lv, improve my young trainers, won the next league and go for the tremble in lv5 (using underleveling method). After that, I 'm thinking to take over a new team lv1.

Meanwhile this season, I 'll try to go with the first team (the high Q players) , to win CH.L.
Attachment 43258

In my league, it's not so easy not to qualify because there are some crap teams and I try to avoid too many "illegal formations" and players oop with the fear of injuries (mine or oppo) or cards.
Attachment 43259

So, sometimes, if I don't watch (to switch my GK with some player), there are some unsatisfied results like this.
Attachment 43260

I tried this trick with a "bad" captain but it didn't work. Also I tried with that player, my GK, to "deactivate" my corners, setting him as the kicker but he still has some success to that :p
Attachment 43262

Also, beside that, I want to improve the performance of a fast trainer MC I bought this season :confused:
Attachment 43264

So, my friend Amane, I 'm listening your suggestions about how to use the captain's position :o

Honestly I don't think you can run a test, actually you can't run tests for quite nothing because there are to many factors from a game to another.

Nordeus answer regarding this was clearly, no bonus, no extra stats is just for design.

Quote:

---

actually you can't run tests for quite nothing because there are to many factors from a game to another.

---

yeah, I know .
I 've made tests - ok, keeping records and observing, about

GK performances/rates
use of right/left foot in corners and free kicks
how to prevent injuries

and that's very true.

The only thing it worked, was about to detect the fast trainers.

any test of benchng works.?

A lot of times I have expeienced a 5 and next match he gets 8-9 (could be same day) also the other way around:rolleyes:

Quote:

---

any test of benchng works.?

---

No, never.
I play with different style.
First of all, I do rotation

Attachment 43435

The only player I use in all games is my GK.
Emerson is the (only) scout player I bought this season and Neymar is the best scorer and maybe the best player I have.
I sub them when I have the luxury to do this (an easy game in league, an easy second leg in CH.L. or in groups) without expecting a bad rate.
I don't know if it's a hint but it's working for me to keep the players in good form.
When I buy a new player and he doesn't perform good, I 'm trying the usual - training/friendlies/changing positions/feet/giving sp and benching but the bad day shows from the morning :(

Forgot to say another interest test/method I do.
I use only one GK in whole season.


Tafarel, seasons 5-6-7
Attachment 43447

Dida seasons 8-9-10 and this one 11
Attachment 43448

after those weird rates of GKs, I decided not to bother much.
So, I buy a GK, young, good trainer, give him one-to-one and test him.
If he gets avg near 7 (some 5s, some 8s) it's ok. Then I just use him in every game.
With the participation in every game and little training, he is finishing the season as a 6*.
Next season, as 5* player, goes to 6*. The same most of my players do.
If he got injured, I heal him asap and use him again. This usually happening once in a season.

for comparing I will just upload mine, I like useing my best player every important game

Attachment 43443Attachment 43446Attachment 43455

Hernandez is an obvious issue, but I am looking for a replacement, and there have only come one 5 star player on marked this season, that I have seen.

2X :eek:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikolgiorgos

Forgot to say another interest test/method I do.
I use only one GK in whole season.


Tafarel, seasons 5-6-7
Attachment 43438

Dida seasons 8-9-10 and this one 11
Attachment 43442

after those weird rates of GKs, I decided not to bother much.
So, I buy a GK, young, good trainer, give him one-to-one and test him.
If he gets avg near 7 (some 5s, some 8s) it's ok. Then I just use him in every game.
With the participation in every game and little training, he is finishing the season as a 6*.
Next season, as 5* player. The same most of my players do.
If he got injured, I heal him asap and use him again. This usually happening once in a season.

---

You made those illegal attachments again :p

as you can se Viera who ranks low performs well with goals:confused:

Quote:

---

You made those illegal attachments again

---

:eek::mad::confused:
fix it I think

Now, that we 're waiting for Amane, let's chat a little.
Well, Gert, in another post you said that scout list players are only for a couple of seasons.
My player Branco, in the 5th line, is the only other player I have (except Emerson) from scout-list.
I bought him 22 y.o., it's his 4th season now, he is 6* player, q78, he is gaining over +50 in 3 bars practice and he is an excellent performer.
So, a young scout/list player can have 4 good years, with high q (6*), maybe 5.

Also want to say, that in the beginning of the season, he had 4-5 rates of 6 in a row and I made him captain - oops, wrong, erase this,
I started using him as DC (instead of DL) and raised his rates a lot.
So, if your player Hernandez, is a DL/DC, you can set him as DC for a couple of games.

Sorry I couldn't be more enlightening on Ratings but its just not possible. Too many things that count are never reported. ;)

Although if you want to play a "Guess the ratings game" then I can give full Match Reports and Full Commentary for you to play with.

The best advice is to accept the ratings as true and interpret the other information to identify if, say a GK who is 'underperforming', represents a critical issue or if its just a single silly mistake from an inactive player that is pulling back his ratings.

All I can say on those 'difficult' ratings positions is mine average:

GK, Andy Goram - 7.19 (37 games)
DC/DMC, Alan Hansen - 7.26 (27)
DC/DMC, Murray Wilson - 7.05 (22)
MC, Liam Henderson - 7.14 (29)
MC, James Morrison - 7.00 (17)
MC, Scott Brown - 7.00 (13)
MC Fernando Ricksen 6.94 (17)

Can't say I'm all that interested in Captain's stuff but I always have a performer there. However, today I subbed my Captain at half-time, second in command was who replaced him and all my players rated 7 or 8.

You have some nice midfielders there Buffs... Mine are almost all pile of midfield s**t... :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Too many things that count are never reported.

---

Exactly, and that's the flaw of the game about the rates (at least for GKs). A management game like this, must give clues to the players, (comments, rates, stats) to figure out what moves they must do, to fix their mistakes, to develop some abilities so to get the best outcome.
If you don't know what's wrong, how you 'll fix it :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikolgiorgos

Now, that we 're waiting for Amane, let's chat a little.
Well, Gert, in another post you said that scout list players are only for a couple of seasons.
My player Branco, in the 5th line, is the only other player I have (except Emerson) from scout-list.
I bought him 22 y.o., it's his 4th season now, he is 6* player, q78, he is gaining over +50 in 3 bars practice and he is an excellent performer.
So, a young scout/list player can have 4 good years, with high q (6*), maybe 5.

Also want to say, that in the beginning of the season, he had 4-5 rates of 6 in a row and I made him captain - oops, wrong, erase this,
I started using him as DC (instead of DL) and raised his rates a lot.
So, if your player Hernandez, is a DL/DC, you can set him as DC for a couple of games.

---

very well, I see your point on scout. (solid yes :) )

Let me clarify what I ment when i said 2-3 seasons.
My pragmatic approach is from a simple cost benift analysis.
each season there comes 18 yeared 5 star fast trainers they gain 150-170 experience from hard training not +50. In simple math that means you will need too feed him tre times the amount of green suitcases too gain the same progress.
And here is my point and the way I rotate my team season wise. When the youth (new nordgen) are getting ahead I find them obsolite (Scouts or 22+) and sell them when I still can get them auctioned.

I will try this idea with playing a DC or DL in the near position when lacking in rating, actually I have sometimes don it because of injuries, and the engine penalty seems rater low.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikolgiorgos

Exactly, and that's the flaw of the game about the rates (at least for GKs). A management game like this, must give clues to the players, (comments, rates, stats) to figure out what moves they must do, to fix their mistakes, to develop some abilities so to get the best outcome.
If you don't know what's wrong, how you 'll fix it :p

---

The T11 Commentary reports around 90+ lines of comment per match, many of them are more than 1 per event - so not much room. Having a full comments list that you could choose to d/l would help but there's the data overheads, they're not currently saved and if the comment selection is embedded in the engine then that would required changed.

We'd need things like Smother, Catch, Punch, Drop, Cross not Claimed, Recovery, Interception etc etc.

Its not going to happen.

Thats why I say instead of trying to 'prove' a rating, just accept it as true and interpret what that means based on your estimation of activity and considering opportunity and expectation. The latter is important because I suspect that lower Q players are punished less in ratings for mistakes if they are so lacking in quality that they're not expected to get to stuff.

I take 6 as average/bored/neutral/nothing exceptional and add or deduct as required - 3 up, 3 down.

Since I play flanks a lot I expect my top performers to be DL, DR, AML, AMR and ST. My DMC will shine or fade because he is either critical or an extra 'safety net'. That helps me decide what ratings are problematic for my system

@ Wolfie - On midfielders I easily forgive a 6 if there are lots of fouls or infrequent bookings. Its only when an extended pattern emerges do I take action *headshot* But I'm usually ruthless with them, only this season have I went 'Nordgen' with 2 of them.

My motto with MCs is "Get them involved". Using wings = short pass, using long pass = red arrows, using def & long pass = blue arrows etc

PS I bet my ratings plummet after writing all this carp.

Quote:

---

I suspect that lower Q players are punished less in ratings for mistakes if they are so lacking in quality that they're not expected to get to stuff.

---

agree to that.
Also I 've accepted the idea that there 's no place in t11 for GKs like Cech, Neuer or Casillas (ok, few years ago :p ).
A great GK with rates of 8 or 9, in a very good team.

Quote:

---

My pragmatic approach is from a simple cost benifit analysis.

---

agree to that too.
That's why I buy only one scout/list every season (avg - some seasons none, some 2). It's the gift of the sponsor to the coach :o

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikolgiorgos

agree to that.
Also I 've accepted the idea that there 's no place in t11 for GKs like Cech, Neuer or Casillas (ok, few years ago :p ).
A great GK with rates of 8 or 9, in a very good team.

---

Even Neuer won't get 8 or 9s if he's playing v crap. My GK has only had a single 9 this Season, 7x 8s. Its those bored 6s that keep his averages down a bit usually but only 2 of those this season so I just imagine that he IS actually amusing himself with some Sweeper Keeper action (outwith the comments). ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PricopGeorgeCătălin

Honestly I don't think you can run a test, actually you can't run tests for quite nothing because there are to many factors from a game to another.

Nordeus answer regarding this was clearly, no bonus, no extra stats is just for design.

---

Can you put a link to this answer please. I find it hard to believe that Nordeus revealed such a dagger to the heart of captain conspiracy theorists.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffs Mad

The T11 Commentary reports around 90+ lines of comment per match, many of them are more than 1 per event - so not much room. Having a full comments list that you could choose to d/l would help but there's the data overheads, they're not currently saved and if the comment selection is embedded in the engine then that would required changed.

We'd need things like Smother, Catch, Punch, Drop, Cross not Claimed, Recovery, Interception etc etc.

Its not going to happen.

Thats why I say instead of trying to 'prove' a rating, just accept it as true and interpret what that means based on your estimation of activity and considering opportunity and expectation. The latter is important because I suspect that lower Q players are punished less in ratings for mistakes if they are so lacking in quality that they're not expected to get to stuff.

I take 6 as average/bored/neutral/nothing exceptional and add or deduct as required - 3 up, 3 down.

Since I play flanks a lot I expect my top performers to be DL, DR, AML, AMR and ST. My DMC will shine or fade because he is either critical or an extra 'safety net'. That helps me decide what ratings are problematic for my system

@ Wolfie - On midfielders I easily forgive a 6 if there are lots of fouls or infrequent bookings. Its only when an extended pattern emerges do I take action *headshot* But I'm usually ruthless with them, only this season have I went 'Nordgen' with 2 of them.

My motto with MCs is "Get them involved". Using wings = short pass, using long pass = red arrows, using def & long pass = blue arrows etc

PS I bet my ratings plummet after writing all this carp.

---

My fav is the he is attempting a bicycle kick one because usually the next comment is the defender taking it or he is moving it to his left foot to shoot.

Usually when one attempts a bicycle kick it actually happens. you cant stop in mid-air unless you are Zlatan. Zlatan can do everything, which is why I name my whole team Zlatan.

Ratings are universal... If a 5* player gets rating 7, in the same game as 6* player he could only get same or better rating, 'cause of better skills, not the opposite...

Quote:

---

Even Neuer won't get 8 or 9s if he's playing v crap

---

yes of course, but let's say real football has the t11 logic.
Someone who can't watch on tv (radio,internet) the games and reads in the "Kicker" about the games of German league, then he could think that Neuer (few goals but inactive, with rates of 6-7) it's just a ok GK
or
someone reading the "Marca" about the rates of Iniesta (not many assists or free-kicks, lack of defending abilities) is thinking that he is a pretty average MC :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Steppenwolf

Ratings are universal... If a 5* player gets rating 7, in the same game as 6* player he could only get same or better rating, 'cause of better skills, not the opposite...

---

I understand it, like that if I have a 4* GK who has a 5* oppo ST who scores (in a corner, free-kick, one-to-one ...)
or
he is a 6* GK, the logic says that he is more qualified and it's more possible to save his goal post, but if both fail, the 6* GK will have a bigger penalty in his rate.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikolgiorgos

the 6* GK will have a bigger penalty in his rate.

---

No, he wont... He would get the same rating if he would play exactly the same, but he wont play exactly the same...

I agree with nik, this is the reason that 6 stars can seem to drop in rating even tho they aer performing the same. As somebody that plays a lot of 2 and 3 star players throughout the season, I would say rating is relative to quality.

Rating is relative to performance... If a 1* and a 9* would play equally same, bad or good, they would both get the same rating... It's not like, if a 9* would get rating 4 for a bad performance related to his quality, that a 1* would get rating 9 if he would play exactly the same... Same performance would result same ratings, no matter how many starts players have...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Steppenwolf

Rating is relative to performance...

---

yes, but what exactly is performance ? Playing good, ODT or having result ?
A GK who played good but his team conceded 5 goals ? A ST who played good, got a rate of 7 because he didn't score ?
So far I couldn't find consequence or codification in whole the games of t11 but anyway rates aren't easy thing to real football too.
What about Mario Gomes (of Bayer Munchen) ? When he scored one goal got a 8 ? 2 goals (or some assists) , a 9 ? No goal, a 7 ?
What is his real value ? What about if he didn't play in a team machine like Bayern ?
Just rhetoric questions ...:p

Ok now, back to the subject of the thread. Amane didn't show up to give me some advices for the Captain but my team must goes on.
My team seams that 'll succeed to tank this season

Attachment 43720

even if it had some hard times
Attachment 43721

Attachment 43722

my DC Torosidis playing as GK, is making fantastic saves, my GK Antoniou clears oppo attacks :p
at least he doesn't assist from the corners (much :o ).

In CH.L. played the first match of the semi final, against a team with this weird formation :eek:

Attachment 43723

Changing my kickers in Corners, Free-kicks, trying to play from the flank with no oppo Def., loosing one-to-one, continually tackling
making oppo GK and defenders, the heroes of the game.
but who can win Nordeus Gods :o

Attachment 43724

thats just wrong :(






I smell a troll

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikolgiorgos

yes, but what exactly is performance ? Playing good, ODT or having result ?
A GK who played good but his team conceded 5 goals ? A ST who played good, got a rate of 7 because he didn't score ?
So far I couldn't find consequence or codification in whole the games of t11 but anyway rates aren't easy thing to real football too.
What about Mario Gomes (of Bayer Munchen) ? When he scored one goal got a 8 ? 2 goals (or some assists) , a 9 ? No goal, a 7 ?
What is his real value ? What about if he didn't play in a team machine like Bayern ?
Just rhetoric questions ...:p

---

It's not only scoring, assisting or conceding goals... There are many things in the game you don't see in stats or events... Passing ratio, intercepted passes, did he run a lot or was just taking a walk all over the pitch, created chances for teammates, did he miss or score a goal in the crucial moments of the game... Just look how tired your players are after the game and compare it with ratings they got... Often a player who didn't play well has still dark green condition bar...

Quote:

---

I smell a troll

---

no, it's not troll. He always playing like this and he is in semis and 2nd in his league

Attachment 43729

Attachment 43730

Attachment 43731

Attachment 43732

Attachment 43733

it's other things we can't see as Step mentioned before
... it's Voodoo

Attachment 43734

Today I had my 2nd leg in CH.L. and I decided not to watch the game. If it's about voodoo, what else a coach can do.
So, I took a little doll and started pin needles in the legs :o (no, I 'm joking).

The result ? as I expected
Attachment 43830

Attachment 43831

so, I 'm out of the final because I had a 0-0 away.
I 'm sure that he 'll win the CH.L. with that weird formation and don't know about his league (he is 2nd, 4p away from the 1st).
I 'm not surprise by that. Spornybal in another thread was explaining how he almost won his league also with a weird formation.

Anyway, Artemis, my second team, is for experiments, it's not going after trophies but if this would happened in my first team, I would be very :mad::mad::mad:

and tanking having problems too.
Those crap teams can't win my worst team, with two less injured players in the field :(

Attachment 43902

Captain is m worst player Antoniou (who is a GK, playing as AM) .

That Горан guy is Mourinho's cousin fo'sho.. :D

Quote:

---

That Горан guy is Mourinho's cousin fo'sho..

---

NO WAY, playing in CH.L. final with two defenders and 6 attackers :eek:
Well, he didn't make it. His GK with only saves wasn't in a good day.
Voodoo wasn't enough to won the cup but a silver plate (plus the 2nd position in his league) isn't bad :rolleyes:

Attachment 43959

Finally I secured staying in the same level
Attachment 43960

so, the team played free against the last of the league (five 9s :) )
Attachment 43961

so, two more things to worry
Should I win the first team of my league (I 'm playing tomorrow with him) and give the trophy to my friend ?

and to sell my crap MC
Hey guys, he is fast trainer, buy him please :p
Attachment 43962

and
Where are you AMANE ....