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Thread: It seems like Quality, Attendance and Tactics mean Nothing in this Game

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ποσιδονας View Post
    Watching Tottenham at CL final (and not 15-20% better quality teams like Barca, Real, JUVE, Bayern, PSG, M.City) , as a football fan also felt cheated
    At least Liveprool won it.
    That's football.
    Note that for Liverpool and Tottenham, they might have won on a fluck, which is why some results aren't terribly surprising. The issue people have is that they feel cheated by the fact that the simulator somehow pre-determines they are going to lose.

    Just had to play against two teams in my league. Both teams are 95%, I am 114. I beat both those teams the first time around. We used the same tactics and I dominated both games. I played my normal counter attack, 4-5-1v style with defensive tactics and defensive bonus.

    Game 1
    We went from 2-0 to 1-1

    Commentary - We just weren't lucky today. Note: Manager wasn't there, I had full bonuses and had +15% for attendance.

    Game 2
    We went from 3-1 to 2-3.

    Commentary - Our GK didn't perform. The opponent really impressed. Note: Manager was present but I had +3% bonus.
    The worst part was that I took the lead after 25 min and was leading 2-0 and then, an incredible thing happened: he scores 3 goals on counters, even though my team instructions were to defend. WTF??!?!?! How does a team that is set to defend get caught 3 times on counter???

    The end result is that now, in my league, I am tied with the second team in terms of points, but I have twice as many goals scored. Also, in 2 games, I was scored twice the number of goals I conceded in 13 games.

    This is exactly the problem with the game. When the simulator has determined you are going to lose, it doesn't matter (1) what you actually do or (2) what you have done (i.e. trained your players and put all bonuses on your side). These results feel like the simulator said: "You are winning the league too easily, therefore you need to lose these games to make it exciting."
    Last edited by Lucian1986; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:48 PM.
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  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucian1986 View Post
    . These results feel like the simulator said: "You are winning the league too easily, therefore you need to lose these games to make it exciting."
    Funnily enough someone on another thread there was complaining that if they were 12 points ahead in the league then they wouldn't get trolled, it only happens when you're close.
    It just shows how differently players perceive the way the game works when bad results happen,
    I think the one constant is that negative result = games fault, positive result = good manager!
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  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by gogs67 View Post
    Funnily enough someone on another thread there was complaining that if they were 12 points ahead in the league then they wouldn't get trolled, it only happens when you're close.
    It just shows how differently players perceive the way the game works when bad results happen,
    I think the one constant is that negative result = games fault, positive result = good manager!
    Not sure that is true. I complained earlier about a result where I won by a heavy margin on two games against an opponent who didn't deserve that. The teams were much closer than this and I seemed to be unfairly favored. When I was up 3-0 after 35 min, I watched the opponent try different strategies to come back into the game but it didn't seem to matter, his players were wandering aimlessly on the pitch.

    Also, would it surprise you that I predicted I would lose those two games? I hadn't lost a game all season, only 2 draws and I had a string of wonky results in my favor (defeating two teams within 10% quality of my team by 3-6 goals).
    Last edited by Lucian1986; 2 Weeks Ago at 05:38 PM.
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  4. #74
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    @Lucian1986
    This is exactly the problem with the game. When the simulator has determined you are going to lose, it doesn't matter (1) what you actually do or (2) what you have done (i.e. trained your players and put all bonuses on your side). These results feel like the simulator said: "You are winning the league too easily, therefore you need to lose these games to make it exciting."
    There are games vs weaker teams, which start bad but you can reverse it.
    And there are games when the result is fixed whatever you do.
    But you wouldn't know that if you are not present and you wouldn't know if you did the right thing to reverse a bad result.

    I beat both those teams the first time around.
    a football game (home and away) vs the same team, never it's the same even if it looks like.
    Like real football sometimes.

    Valverde would think
    "We won them 3-0 at home, almost 5-0 if didn't loose those last min shots
    and we lost 4-0 ? wtf"
    Καλώς ήρθατε στο Ελληνικό φόρουμ
    http://forum.topeleven.com/%CE%93%CE...%B4%CE%B1.html

  5. #75
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    I don't think most managers are angry at the unexpected losses per say, but more at the games where they are the superior team, and games stats are fully in their favor after the game but they still end up losing or drawing. It shouldn't only be against weaker teams that we spot these problems because you might play a team that is near in percentage to you and you still lose regardless of the fact that stats are fully in your favor.
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  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Junior King View Post
    I don't think most managers are angry at the unexpected losses per say, but more at the games where they are the superior team, and games stats are fully in their favor after the game but they still end up losing or drawing. It shouldn't only be against weaker teams that we spot these problems because you might play a team that is near in percentage to you and you still lose regardless of the fact that stats are fully in your favor.
    Agreed, though I think you can also see it against comparable teams as well, like when there is a 5% difference and you cream them 8-0. I remember a game where I was 5% stronger than an opponent and I ended up losing 5-1 (he had 6 shots on target).

    I do think the frequency of the trolls is problematic. When I get a troll result, like the unexpected tie against a team 15-20% weaker, if I play against another team with similar quality right afterwards, I am almost always right in predicting I will lose that match too. Also, it is always strange when you see a game you dominated and they scored 3 goals against you with a 100% accuracy rate. Meanwhile, you are stuck at a 12% accuracy rate.

    Going back to the fixed games, there are certain things I believe you should expect and certain situations that are unreasonable. If you play defensive, you expect to get scored against on long shots, not take 3 goals on counters where your entire team, for some reason, is at the midfield point.
    Last edited by Lucian1986; 2 Weeks Ago at 09:32 PM.
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  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucian1986 View Post
    Agreed, though I think you can also see it against comparable teams as well, like when there is a 5% difference and you cream them 8-0. I remember a game where I was 5% stronger than an opponent and I ended up losing 5-1 (he had 6 shots on target).

    I do think the frequency of the trolls is problematic. When I get a troll result, like the unexpected tie against a team 15-20% weaker, if I play against another team with similar quality right afterwards, I am almost always right in predicting I will lose that match too. Also, it is always strange when you see a game you dominated and they scored 3 goals against you with a 100% accuracy rate. Meanwhile, you are stuck at a 12% accuracy rate.

    Going back to the fixed games, there are certain things I believe you should expect and certain situations that are unreasonable. If you play defensive, you expect to get scored against on long shots, not take 3 goals on counters where your entire team, for some reason, is at the midfield point.
    Yeah, I agree with as well. It shouldn't be that way especially between teams that are near in ratings. In football upsets are always happening but they barely happen in a league or with teams that are so drastically apart in ratings. Trolls often happen when your team is sometimes in the best of form vs the weakest of teams. In the football world you can pin point factors that lead to unexpected results, but in Top Eleven, a game that they say tries to imitate the real world of football doesn't take that in consideration. You could be winning 7 to 8 games in a row in a specific competition, and then you play a weaker team and you unexpectedly lose or draw. One two unexplainable draws and losses are okay but when you have 5 to 10 of them in a season where there are like 40 games in total, that's shouldn't be.

    I think that Top Eleven should recalibrate their system and consider the number of these unexplainable results because per season it is too much in such a short time. Take Barcelona for instance, yes they have results that are unexpected but they are not so much. When they are in form their games are grsst and when they're having a bad season you can tell. Top Eleven should consider that and make the ratio relative to the amount of time in a season. And in games effort should be rewarded and not how they think the game should turn out.
    Last edited by Junior King; 2 Weeks Ago at 11:05 PM.

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Junior King View Post
    Yeah, I agree with as well. It shouldn't be that way especially between teams that are near in ratings. In football upsets are always happening but they barely happen in a league or with teams that are so drastically apart in ratings. Trolls often happen when your team is sometimes in the best of form vs the weakest of teams. In the football world you can pin point factors that lead to unexpected results, but in Top Eleven, a game that they say tries to imitate the real world of football doesn't take that in consideration. You could be winning 7 to 8 games in a row in a specific competition, and then you play a weaker team and you unexpectedly lose or draw. One two unexplainable draws and losses are okay but when you have 5 to 10 of them in a season where there are like 40 games in total, that's shouldn't be.

    I think that Top Eleven should recalibrate their system and consider the number of these unexplainable results because per season it is too much in such a short time. Take Barcelona for instance, yes they have results that are unexpected but they are not so much. When they are in form their games are grsst and when they're having a bad season you can tell. Top Eleven should consider that and make the ratio relative to the amount of time in a season. And in games effort should be rewarded and not how they think the game should turn out.

    New troll result with me on the winning end.

    Champions League Round of 18 - playing at home with my 113% team against a 98% team.

    I showed up to the game at 45' and was the only spectator.

    Tactics: 4-5-1V style vs 4-4-2
    Possession: 66 vs 34
    Total Shots: 19 vs 12
    Shots on target: 9 vs 4
    Corners: 8 vs 9
    Saves: 3 vs 2
    Fouls: 10 vs 11
    Tackles: 26 vs 21

    So far, seems like a relatively even game.

    End Score: 7-0! This is nonsense. By all means, please tell me how this would happen in a real game.
    Last edited by Lucian1986; 2 Weeks Ago at 11:51 PM.
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  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucian1986 View Post
    New troll result with me on the winning end.

    Champions League Round of 18 - playing at home with my 113% team against a 98% team.

    I showed up to the game at 45' and was the only spectator.

    Tactics: 4-5-1V style vs 4-4-2
    Possession: 66 vs 34
    Total Shots: 19 vs 12
    Shots on target: 9 vs 4
    Corners: 8 vs 9
    Saves: 3 vs 2
    Fouls: 10 vs 11
    Tackles: 26 vs 21

    So far, seems like a relatively even game.

    End Score: 7-0! This is nonsense. By all means, please tell me how this would happen in a real game.
    As you have said that shouldn't be. With teams at thay level it should be a game that is closely contested. Realistic blow outs in the Champions League are around 5-1 or 6-0 unless you meet an extremely weak team. Well blowouts are more common or should be more common in the group stages and not during the knockouts.

    I just played Champions League RO16, and I'm playing away and lost 3-1, but I beat the team 3-1 at home. I'm at 90% and he's at 79%. Losses can happen at that difference but the stats don't show up. I was there form the start of the game and he wasn't.
    Tactucs: 4-5-1V vs 4-5-1V
    Possessions: 25 vs 75
    Shots: 16 vs 24
    Shots on target: 6 vs 10
    Completed papsses: 80% vs 85%
    Corners: 4 vs 9
    Saves: 5 vs 1
    Red cards: 1 vs 0

    That guy nearly did a comeback on me in the RO16. Lol!!!!

  10. #80
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    I don't know but I have noticed some times that entering the game late seems to be profitable, especially in terms of goals scored. Also I have seen experienced tankers (although I am level 9 there is people who has won 20-30+ cups here) use this method regularly in games they didn't want to lose. Who knows.

    Inviato dal mio SM-A750FN utilizzando Tapatalk

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