Ball possession - how comes ?

[Tactician]

Presence of oppo manager and his actions affect but I am talking about games were he isnt present.

I cannot confirm anything, but from my side, I have noticed less advantages to my team when opposing manager is absent as compared to way before.

[Mitja fc]

Dnt know I checked another match...the moment i stop pressing possesion bonus it changed for 5 %
But not from 61% to 56% but from 61% to 58%
So 5% bonus means 2.5% + for me and 2.5%- for opp
8% means you gain +4% and opp lose 4%

But it always changes...

[IImaestroII]

I mostly play attacking formation, i played possesion based tactics and non possession based. With possession based i mean , i press high up my oppo recover the ball and once ball recovered play "tiki-taka" stretching the play wide or playing through the middle ( mixed focus pass )

For example this


Playing like this sometimes i get almost 80% poss ( even with same quality oppo )

Other times i play attacking but not possesion based ( loosing possesion on purpose ) with long passes so once i recover the ball high up my players ( mostly playmakers ) launch fast long balls to sts. Like Liverpool gegenpressing style

For example this


Of course you can also have more possession playing defensive outplaying the oppo high pressure



So for me what matters for %poss is :
- Formation (most important )
- Type of passing
- Quality
- supporters

[khris]

Dnt know I checked another match...the moment i stop pressing possesion bonus it changed for 5 %
But not from 61% to 56% but from 61% to 58%
So 5% bonus means 2.5% + for me and 2.5%- for opp
8% means you gain +4% and opp lose 4%

But it always changes...

Nono... do not confuse the "attendance possesion bonus" that is a +5% and +8 if you attend (with full stadium)**

and the "training bonus" that you have to activate that do not give a +5% (10% to15%) because it doesn't work like this, these bonuses, "activate a BP in certain players, not in all", so it is not = a +5% BP exactly.

You can see it for example by pushing the condition bonus during a whole match, and another match without. You'll notice that "some players, 4-5 now not sure but I tested it, lose less condition than the others.

But these training bonuses are selective, not applied to all team. And the 4 work in the same way.




...and well... I think I solved part of the main topic of this thread xD

[khris]

Then: -formula to calculate the possesion in every scenario

Def-3 lines-gk,dcs-dms =X per total
M-dms-mcs-ams = Y per total
A-ams-sts = Z per total


(Total = never counting the 11 players because the simulator choses "random protagonist players in eevry match")
+some players sum +1%-maybe some +3% individually.

This can decide part of the possession balance, and I think that the orders matter more than the formations cause:
-the 1st group D-M-A can be "activated/reinforced" always "when the scenario is chosen"

ex- today you will control the match playing defensive, so switch At. mentality to defensive would activate this possession from the Def' line-¿?

+every scenario can pre-set a +(?)% possession depending of the AvQ diff¿? or a random pre-scenario (but I doubt it because the final score never will depend of the visual possession and we know it, so I think that this number is just a number that comes from a simple formula) and that the "pre-scenario have more influence 4 example in the "chances" and "how effective are the players" and thats why are 2 separated things, and the possession dont decide but the factor of chances, yes.

[khris]

ohh ***** thats why Ive been listening since the V.1 lol

[Reece p FC]

Then: -formula to calculate the possesion in every scenario

Def-3 lines-gk,dcs-dms =X per total
M-dms-mcs-ams = Y per total
A-ams-sts = Z per total


(Total = never counting the 11 players because the simulator choses "random protagonist players in eevry match")
+some players sum +1%-maybe some +3% individually.

This can decide part of the possession balance, and I think that the orders matter more than the formations cause:
-the 1st group D-M-A can be "activated/reinforced" always "when the scenario is chosen"

ex- today you will control the match playing defensive, so switch At. mentality to defensive would activate this possession from the Def' line-¿?

+every scenario can pre-set a +(?)% possession depending of the AvQ diff¿? or a random pre-scenario (but I doubt it because the final score never will depend of the visual possession and we know it, so I think that this number is just a number that comes from a simple formula) and that the "pre-scenario have more influence 4 example in the "chances" and "how effective are the players" and thats why are 2 separated things, and the possession dont decide but the factor of chances, yes.

if the predetermination of a player to have a good game is changed, do you think that changes to the new player if there is a substitution? and does that change if he is changed with player from different position and tactics changed?

[khris]

if the predetermination of a player to have a good game is changed, do you think that changes to the new player if there is a substitution? and does that change if he is changed with player from different position and tactics changed?

The scenario is set once one of these 4 "big simplifyed scenarios" is decided (attend vs attend, att vs nope, nope vs nope and nope vs attend)

the game tend to sub divide the players of each team and assign roles so,
some players will appear more, internally they will have more % of visual contribution (good or bad, if this is good, we are talking of a Key Player)
key players tend to solve almost the 70% of the matches and appear in almost all -this was checked by me when the old version that just showed the comments existed, now one can deactivate the live animation and check the writen comments)
then there are,
neutral players, who maybe never appear, never do contributions but, these, can have a positive impact with the players they have arround, or, a negative impact
and the "normal" players, these are used usually by the game to, decide in a alterne behavior, some matches and contribute in a way that the scenarios variability say, so these tend to have ratings like 6-8-6-8-7 (up-down-up-and so cause are determinant days yes/days nope.

the scenario decides "who" is determinant and "where", and yes, some players tend to play better "too" not only in their usual positions, Ive used STs as aml-r's...
so we can say that, if the game decides that your st's line will fail continously, but that your chances will come from the AMR you can switch it and it can work.

Same with the subs, if your field is full of "predetermined bad impacted players for that match" , yes, it can happen that if you do a sub, a new player can change absolutely all.
I remember this week when I've been experimenting and I wrote about a situation in what a team couldn't score been active, with higher avq, (trained for sure) and my team without bonuses, till the 58' when he did 3 subs and scored 4 goals then.


So, IMO, yes, you can affect a scenario, of course once you know it. The game always, always will give you options to do something with what you have, thats why formation don't matters, because if the players are predetermined to outdo anyone on the field, hats all what yo need.

[Reece p FC]

The scenario is set once one of these 4 "big simplifyed scenarios" is decided (attend vs attend, att vs nope, nope vs nope and nope vs attend)

the game tend to sub divide the players of each team and assign roles so,
some players will appear more, internally they will have more % of visual contribution (good or bad, if this is good, we are talking of a Key Player)
key players tend to solve almost the 70% of the matches and appear in almost all -this was checked by me when the old version that just showed the comments existed, now one can deactivate the live animation and check the writen comments)
then there are,
neutral players, who maybe never appear, never do contributions but, these, can have a positive impact with the players they have arround, or, a negative impact
and the "normal" players, these are used usually by the game to, decide in a alterne behavior, some matches and contribute in a way that the scenarios variability say, so these tend to have ratings like 6-8-6-8-7 (up-down-up-and so cause are determinant days yes/days nope.

the scenario decides "who" is determinant and "where", and yes, some players tend to play better "too" not only in their usual positions, Ive used STs as aml-r's...
so we can say that, if the game decides that your st's line will fail continously, but that your chances will come from the AMR you can switch it and it can work.

Same with the subs, if your field is full of "predetermined bad impacted players for that match" , yes, it can happen that if you do a sub, a new player can change absolutely all.
I remember this week when I've been experimenting and I wrote about a situation in what a team couldn't score been active, with higher avq, (trained for sure) and my team without bonuses, till the 58' when he did 3 subs and scored 4 goals then.


So, IMO, yes, you can affect a scenario, of course once you know it. The game always, always will give you options to do something with what you have, thats why formation don't matters, because if the players are predetermined to outdo anyone on the field, hats all what yo need.

do you have any opinion on good or bad times to make subs? I tend to look from half time onwards, if I haven't had to replace an injured or yellow carded player, I may if behind make a half time sub, if level may wait til the hour and maybe do a 2nd at 70 min, do you think they have much chance of making an impact if you leave it til say the 80th minute, or do you think more than 1 at a time is maybe best if behind or needing a win when level?

also, the 4 bonuses you can use, I see some people talk about using them through the match, do many do this? I tend to wait til the 70th minute and use as an end of game boost, but I cant tell if it ever makes a difference or not, sometimes i'll be 4-0 up at half time against a really weak team and even using the attack boost still not score another goal in the whole 2nd half

[khris]

do you have any opinion on good or bad times to make subs? I tend to look from half time onwards, if I haven't had to replace an injured or yellow carded player, I may if behind make a half time sub, if level may wait til the hour and maybe do a 2nd at 70 min, do you think they have much chance of making an impact if you leave it til say the 80th minute, or do you think more than 1 at a time is maybe best if behind or needing a win when level?

also, the 4 bonuses you can use, I see some people talk about using them through the match, do many do this? I tend to wait til the 70th minute and use as an end of game boost, but I cant tell if it ever makes a difference or not, sometimes i'll be 4-0 up at half time against a really weak team and even using the attack boost still not score another goal in the whole 2nd half

Bonuses make the difference, yes. And is a good idea use 4 (even if it is the same) during the match.

I tend to sub' in the 50' if, for example, I do not see a player appearing as I would like in the animation -in the old comments, that you can set by default- if a name did not appear I subbed' the player.
Then if a player appears but he continously fail, 2,3,4 times, exist the option of switching (like ST to AM'r-l or inclusive I move my amc as MC) or you can sub him.
And if there's a agressive player losing balls or just provoking free kicks against, sub too.

I consider something like a sub' if, a FK or a corner is missed 2-3 times by a player and I change the man for that job too.

The most important is find the way to control the chances, that should be in your favour despite have a close bar possession or when the bar is against you, or, if you find the way to control this bar "clearly" -like change to defensive mentality and you see that the bar changes suddenly to a 62% to you from 51% - then, perfect, that's the idea.