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Thread: Does anybody think we can influence the game? (part 2) Let's make some experiments.

  1. #11
    Apprentice The_Savage_1's Avatar
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    The difference in condition loss between hard pressing and man to man compared to low pressing and zonal is significant. If you wanted to prove whether any changes made after the match kicks off actually took effect or whether matches were completely predetermined, a simple test where you compared condition loss of games where you did the whole match with hard press and man to man against matches started with hard press and man to man but changed to low press and zonal as soon as the match begins would do the trick.
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  2. #12
    Spanish Forum Moderator khris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Savage_1 View Post
    The difference in condition loss between hard pressing and man to man compared to low pressing and zonal is significant. If you wanted to prove whether any changes made after the match kicks off actually took effect or whether matches were completely predetermined, a simple test where you compared condition loss of games where you did the whole match with hard press and man to man against matches started with hard press and man to man but changed to low press and zonal as soon as the match begins would do the trick.
    Ive been asking this recently, because those who played in 2015 remember the bonuses we had associated in exchange of condition,,, so Ive been trying togather more info to know what happenned with these as 3 months later the training system was introduced and we had the 4 10% bonuses...

    But thats the reason why I always play MtM and HIgh press...

  3. #13
    Moderator IImaestroII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khris View Post
    Ive been asking this recently, because those who played in 2015 remember the bonuses we had associated in exchange of condition,,, so Ive been trying togather more info to know what happenned with these as 3 months later the training system was introduced and we had the 4 10% bonuses...

    But thats the reason why I always play MtM and HIgh press...
    Mtm and Zonal is a big debate, I played both and won with both. What i can say is:

    - Mtm marking if used properly can really be game breaking , but need too much work for the manager as you need to adapt always your formation depending on oppo or else you will get a big lose.

    -Zonal marking is the best beacause your team will defend as a "collective" relying more on the offside trap to compensate possible formation flaws ( like a player not marked , pacy players that cannot be man marked. ect... ), you can play any formation with this.

    Regarding what The Savage says there is no sure advantage if you use low press/zonal vs hard press , you can stay deep -low press and defend but that doesn't mean you will win , if oppo manage to close you on your half and didn't let you build up from the back you are going to lose. All depends on tactics.

    “Football is born in the brain, not in the body"

  4. #14
    Spanish Forum Moderator khris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IImaestroII View Post
    Mtm and Zonal is a big debate, I played both and won with both. What i can say is:

    - Mtm marking if used properly can really be game breaking , but need too much work for the manager as you need to adapt always your formation depending on oppo or else you will get a big lose.

    -Zonal marking is the best beacause your team will defend as a "collective" relying more on the offside trap to compensate possible formation flaws ( like a player not marked , pacy players that cannot be man marked. ect... ), you can play any formation with this.

    Regarding what The Savage says there is no sure advantage if you use low press/zonal vs hard press , you can stay deep -low press and defend but that doesn't mean you will win , if oppo manage to close you on your half and didn't let you build up from the back you are going to lose. All depends on tactics.
    No no... if it hasn't been touched or modifyed, there was a attack bonus in the hard press option, in exchange of condition, and a defense bonus, in MtM too in exchange of condition.... and both options activated are "always a advantadge in some sense"...

    If Im right there isn't a calibration in where to play Zonal gives an specific advantadge... this does not exist, it is only something that affect visualy, but the advantadge "if I'm right and nothing has changed" is activating the MtM and, too the high press.

  5. #15
    Spanish Forum Moderator khris's Avatar
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    hmm... the truth is that I know that, training bonuses are applied randomly to a part of players of da team... but I do not remember if these 2 options affect fully the team or are random... I think it worked like the training bonuses but not sure... still but, it can be tesed so easy.... later I'll open a trhead to see if these options work in same way as the 4 training bonuses... this should be easy to spot.

  6. #16
    Moderator IImaestroII's Avatar
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    Yes we can influence the match, time ago i played a important cl match at home , we played both attacking hard press and we had same quality( me 9% stronger ), but i draw 1-1 the match at home. While watching the match i noticed that he pressed better that me,and i asked my self, why? Then i noticed from the stats that he made more fouls than me ( like 15-8 ) so during the away match i switched to hard tackling (he was winning 1-0) and magic, he didn't touch the ball till the end and i won 1-4 , that means i really go easy on him at home and he was really aggressive. From there i started to take always a look at the number of fouls during matches, and other stats like pass.acc % and etc...

    So yes , you can influence the match if you are a good observer
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    “Football is born in the brain, not in the body"

  7. #17
    Moderator IImaestroII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khris View Post
    No no... if it hasn't been touched or modifyed, there was a attack bonus in the hard press option, in exchange of condition, and a defense bonus, in MtM too in exchange of condition.... and both options activated are "always a advantadge in some sense"...

    If Im right there isn't a calibration in where to play Zonal gives an specific advantadge... this does not exist, it is only something that affect visualy, but the advantadge "if I'm right and nothing has changed" is activating the MtM and, too the high press.
    So you are saying that is like a "give it all you have got " option? i have played some matches switching between mtm and zonal and sometimes is better sometimes is worse. From my experience against equal/ stronger teams i played zonal , beacause with rigid man marking if oppo strikers are faster or good dribblers they will beat your defenders, the only way ( or the only weapon is the offside trap ). I use some times MtM against small teams in other to reduce their chances (that are already low due to quality difference ) so to prevent possible troll matches
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    “Football is born in the brain, not in the body"

  8. #18
    Spanish Forum Moderator khris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IImaestroII View Post
    So you are saying that is like a "give it all you have got " option? i have played some matches switching between mtm and zonal and sometimes is better sometimes is worse. From my experience against equal/ stronger teams i played zonal , beacause with rigid man marking if oppo strikers are faster or good dribblers they will beat your defenders, the only way ( or the only weapon is the offside trap ). I use some times MtM against small teams in other to reduce their chances (that are already low due to quality difference ) so to prevent possible troll matches
    " i played zonal , beacause with rigid man marking if oppo strikers are faster or good dribblers they will beat your defenders,"

    This is a theory, affected for the visual perception -of course players move different in the live animations switching orders as, switching passing options- but here "if I can confirm that these 2 options, are associated to the 2 bonuses" it is not the same, cause the scenario can make work better long passing or short, but in "all cases despite the visual effect, players should work slightly better, pressing hard, and with the MtM.....

    without anydoubt, and despite the "visual effect" that makes one think in the logical behavior of the players, right? cause as you say, zonal should move the line more equally... "in theory" but in this case, as it was set, it is the same to have this theory, or the theory that, as visually a 7* ST is better than a 5*, and this is not true, we know very well that a 5* can score 40 goals and the 7* can act like invisible man the 50% of the season...

    and thats the same, "seems logic" to say that, "zonal keeps more players in a zone" and "in theory, they should keep the line to provoke offsides easily true? but IMO, nope. This game don't goes too far away and isn't too much detalied in a "minimalistic way" to make this little option impact in big scale...


    The only thing that can occur, is that if both options do not use more condition than zonal and low pressure, than, yes, then should exist a "signal" that means we need to use these options, as when u use long/mixed passing and u lose the bal 3 consecutive times.... then is when the game want u switching to short passing...

    Really, it needs a deep analysis .. and some confirmation cause if the options are linked to consition usage, "always" will mean that, theres a benefit behind this, depsite the visual stuffs we can see... thats an illusion man... just an illusion xD

  9. #19
    Greek Forum Moderator nikolgiorgos's Avatar
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    " i played zonal , beacause with rigid man marking if oppo strikers are faster or good dribblers they will beat your defenders,"
    don't overestimate the AI of the game mechanics
    As Khris said, you give smthing (like more condition loss), you earn a little of something else.
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  10. #20
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    Predetermined factors that impact a match but cannot be changed during a match: Condition, Morale, Training bonus, Win bonus

    Factors that can be changed in match and do impact a match: Tactics
    Level 40 Manager

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