What did I do wrong? Some advices would be welcomed

[Wraga]

I had a hard beat from this enemy team:



This was my setup:



This is the result:

According to details, I was using setup found in this article:

https://top-eleven-tactics-games.blo...ormations.html

Even it was promising, I had 0 shot efficiency and had a crushing lost what most probably cannot be recovered in the next round.

The opponent has a 7% star advantage and seems as a passive account, however I have no idea how to beat him.

Any suggestions or ideas what was wrong and how could I counter him effectively?

Thank you

[khris]

approved post**

[Tales Kuo]

Hey Wraga,

Good day and can you show the detail of statistis?
Maybe we can try to find some useful information from it.

[Wraga]

Sure thing, here are the details of the match.



Thank you for your time

[HeavensAAA]

Hi Wraga,

Firstly the following is just a suggestion. There is no right or wrong in tactics, but more about if it is a more suitable and effective counter with a best estimate of what the opponent would do (eg. 4-3w-3w would suggest opponents playing via flank, and if that opponent manager somehow choose to play via middle then things could be unpredictable).

With your scenario, the first thing I would do differently is to overload opposition DMC area(without DMC is as good as it gets) instead of both flanks with fullbacks. Second main concern is both opposition best ST & MC is 1* above your team’s, so both areas require at least +1 player to offset the quality disadvantage, hence 3 defenders and 4 midfielders is a default to have a more controlled match (gung-ho aggressive setup to win by outscoring would mean win-1-lose-1, and that would lose all trophies easily). DMC to counter AMC is spot on there, so the default formation would be 3-1-4 up till midfield. Game control-wise would be playing a AMC + ST.




To utilise the most of AMC area, playing 1 AMC + 1 ST in the conventional positions may not be the best option. Considering the opponent has 2 DCs, our ST should always move away from them to score easier, if possible. MC quality difference is still a concern even with a 1-man advantage, so the better solution would be moving MCs back a little (to help DMC a bit), then pull AMC as back as possible (creating a 3v1 triangle vs opposition 3 midfielders), and finally move ST as back as possible too. Central AMC area should be where the game is won (opposition has ‘wasted’ 2 players with wide defenders irrelevant for the match setup in this way).

[Wraga]

Thank you for your time and tips, I do appreciate.

I was wondering how would it be possible to be effective against this setup and I thought maybe forcing the play on the wings would help but as you mentioned the enemy team has stronger players, thus it takes more people from my side to keep them controlled. With these circumstances I see zero chance to get back from 0-5, however your opinion and suggestions would be helpful to be more effective in the future.

I would like to also thank you for your effort and showing me the example of the mentioned setup.

Right now I am thinking between the mentioned formation and the 4231 formation what I used to use against stronger enemies usually. The "problem" is that enemy team has a 5 goal advantage thus I cannot focus on defense because it wouldnt make sense in this situation.

In case I would have ask this question before the first match, I would definitely go with your setup, however at the moment I have to risk if I dont want to end my cup presence here.

[HeavensAAA]

Thank you for your time and tips, I do appreciate.

I was wondering how would it be possible to be effective against this setup and I thought maybe forcing the play on the wings would help but as you mentioned the enemy team has stronger players, thus it takes more people from my side to keep them controlled. With these circumstances I see zero chance to get back from 0-5, however your opinion and suggestions would be helpful to be more effective in the future.

I would like to also thank you for your effort and showing me the example of the mentioned setup.

Right now I am thinking between the mentioned formation and the 4231 formation what I used to use against stronger enemies usually. The "problem" is that enemy team has a 5 goal advantage thus I cannot focus on defense because it wouldnt make sense in this situation.

In case I would have ask this question before the first match, I would definitely go with your setup, however at the moment I have to risk if I dont want to end my cup presence here.

You are more than welcome!

To win by 5 net goals against a superior opponent obviously is extremely difficult, regardless of team setup and tactics which are mostly catered for a win of around 3 goals against similar strength teams (well, everyone has their own opinion. I would only conclude that my setup is effective with a win of no less than 3 goals against same-quality opponents on a consistent basis). Need some luck and players in form to win by 5 or more.

A defensive setup with counter on plus mixed passing (short cannot create chance & long is way too prone to superior opponent’s counter) can easily win by 5 goals too when ST & AMC are on fire. Focus power training onto the best 2 young attackers first would yield the best results with the least resources.

4-2-3-1 is fine in trying to chasing goals under the circumstances as well, as there is nothing to loss and everything to gain. Good luck there!

[Wraga]

Thank you for your fast response and your opinion as well.

Actually I am thinking about using your setup due to the mentioned details, plus it look coherent and effective. The only one problem would be the lack of good MR and ML so the original 4231 would give more benefits due to quaility players on those roles.

It might be possible to use your setup with AML and AMR while trying to move them as back as possible.

Anyway, I would give it a go because as you just mentioned, there is nothing to lose from this situation and at least I can test, how effective would be another setup against a stronger opponent.

I do appreciate your kindness, wish you a great day.

[Wraga]

I just had the match so wanted to share with you the result.

Even if I am out of the cup, I think its a huge achievement after the crushing loss at the first leg. Its sad I was not asking for advices earlier, but if I can learn by it than it will be a lesson not a mistake.

Thank you again for your help and advices, I was using the setup you suggested with AMR/AML instead of MR/ML due to the reason mentioned earlier.

I will definitely look around more because it looks like there are plenty of players with a valuable knowledge, like you.

Take care

[HeavensAAA]

I just had the match so wanted to share with you the result.

Attachment 136198

Even if I am out of the cup, I think its a huge achievement after the crushing loss at the first leg. Its sad I was not asking for advices earlier, but if I can learn by it than it will be a lesson not a mistake.

Thank you again for your help and advices, I was using the setup you suggested with AMR/AML instead of MR/ML due to the reason mentioned earlier.

I will definitely look around more because it looks like there are plenty of players with a valuable knowledge, like you.

Take care

Very nice to get a feedback with a great result there for you. Obviously not as good as the 5 goals we would have hoped for, but then 3 goals net win against a superior quality team is a clear indicator that the team setup is spot on. The possession of 72% vs 38% before tells its story - to get a 5-0 win would require 40% of total shots to go in and that’s the extra luck needed.

The difference of setup with AML/R and ML/MR would not be too huge if you pull both back to both the ML/MR region, especially when 2 MCs and AMC are covering more than enough in MC area that the 2 MCs could still manage to close those gaps in defensive mode.

And thanks for your compliment, though there are lots of managers way better than me out there. We all learned through mistakes before and can only get better.

Do ask for specifics here, especially when there are important ties. Take care too!

One last note on players and positions - we all have a fair value in T-worth and preference of a few favourite formations, hence players that we would look at. For me, both non-defender flank players must be both ML/AML(R), because they can play:

a) conventional wide ML + MR to take advantage of space out wide against no ML/MR formations
b) packed ML + MR close to middle with 1 MC to win against 2 MCs formation
c) when chasing goals, then push them as forward as 3ST (middle) or wide wingers if needed
d) when defending 1-goal lead, pulled both back to close to DL & DR region, along with 3DCs + 1 DMC - very difficult to break down 3-3 in defensive mode with limited time

The extra in-game without-sub benefits above alone is worth a few more T.