Understanding role of Luck in top eleven

[nikolgiorgos]

Luck doesn't occur in every TE game but is good to know and explain some weird- unbalance results like that I had in the cup semifinals.
The difference was that in the first semi oppo manager was present and I set the cheap win bonus but cannot understand how those can explain that goal difference.

[IImaestroII]

Ok i will use my case as an example

many matches against tankers, so high score results , then troll matches after( or let's call then match with poor performances)



then almost got trolled in my league match by a much weaker oppo ( i wasn't present , so probably that save me ! ), 2-2 cl match , winning 2-0 1st half , but my players missed manay chances ( cuold be 4-0 ) , then oppo logge in ( without change tactics ) score 2-2 fast.





So the " Crisis" started and i guess i have to pay for the previous super perfonmances against the tankers, a 4-0 defeat came from a stronger oppo ( 134 vs 151) the team played well till 60 mins" but with 0% shot eff. so after that the team started to making lot of fouls and oppo scored from fk , penalty , etc. a hard KO for the league. But i guess i had to pay more than that, got trolled the league match after then i lost cl on penalties , with the same result ( 2-2 ) , same story low shot eff% , only my gk was playing good in that match ( lot of saves ), assistant said that " THEY WERE FAVOURITES " even if i was stronger ..






Same thing happened , more time ago , when i got eliminated in cup by weaker oppo.







SO BE CAREFULL GUYS THESE MATCHES AGAINST TANKERS ARE TRAPS ANS YOU WILL PAY IT IN IMPORTANT MATCHES

[Lucian1986]

Ok, someone could say
wth, is this a managerial game or a slot machine ?

Well yes, the roll dice has a big role in TE. Bigger than we would like to be.
But still we can try to understand and manage in some part also the role of luck.
(Khris also have spot that trying some different method in another thread).

What I could do if for example in my asso game won and have my GK motm ?
hmm, maybe using my sub GK even if he has lower quality
or playing the game in auto/watching from another account I have
or playing a couple of friendlies with PARTIZAN (via associations) so to reset some counter or to confuse the game engine.
(this tip I gave to a friend and it worked in his final).

This all sounds like slot machine play to me. Plus, assuming you are able to find a pattern, then it doesn't make the game any less broken, it just means you know ahead of time that your team will be rubbish. How does this make the game fun?

[khris]

This all sounds like slot machine play to me. Plus, assuming you are able to find a pattern, then it doesn't make the game any less broken, it just means you know ahead of time that your team will be rubbish. How does this make the game fun?

The game is fun if you don't watch deeply what creates the illusion. At least for some managers, for me it's fun understand how it works and apply my theories.

The game isn't fixed in a way that gives the win to the team with more AvQ, there are different parameters that makes it realistic, ofc. if you understand how this variability works, then you can manipulate it.

Still many managers that have been playing more than 5 years never asked themselves about the internal programming of Top Eleven, so they still believe that this is based purely on tactics and some logic in the way to manage tactically, but, thats a illusion, once you understand that the game never simulates in a direct 1vs1 way,, but in a individual and spared system.

This is a game and need a system to work, couldn't work with a system in where the direct formations changes give a clear advantadge vs some other formations, as this would create absolutely paranoid matches with 25 formation changes ....the game have parameters and a behavior that after playing for many years and knowing all the updates that the game has launched since the V.1 can be understood.

[nikolgiorgos]

This all sounds like slot machine play to me. Plus, assuming you are able to find a pattern, then it doesn't make the game any less broken, it just means you know ahead of time that your team will be rubbish. How does this make the game fun?

nope, as I said in a previous post, TE is like the backgammon game.
If you want a game with pure tactics, play chess.

[Lucian1986]

nope, as I said in a previous post, TE is like the backgammon game.
If you want a game with pure tactics, play chess.

Not sure I would compare backgammon to slot machines.

Khris, thanks for your elaborate response. I can see how that would be interesting to some, though I fear that, given the number of complaints about trolling, this isn't what players want. Indeed, I would go as far as to say that the level of frustration about trolling is because the game advertises a semblance of agency and control over your team and people are being denied this.

What do you mean by: "the game never simulates in a direct 1vs1 way,, but in a individual and spared system." Are you positing that each team plays essentially against itself and then the results are compared?

[nikolgiorgos]

Not sure I would compare backgammon to slot machines.

it's not a slot machine, it's backgammon.
If it was a slot machine i wouldn't have 132 1st cups and you wouldn't have those

Level 10
10 x League Champion
6 x Champions League Winner (2 x Runner Up)
7 x Cup Winner (2 x Runner Up)
5 x Super Cup Winner
434 Wins/ 40 Draws / 24 Losses
1945 Goals Scored / 283 Goals Conceded/ 71 Games Longest Unbeaten Streak

[khris]

Not sure I would compare backgammon to slot machines.

Khris, thanks for your elaborate response. I can see how that would be interesting to some, though I fear that, given the number of complaints about trolling, this isn't what players want. Indeed, I would go as far as to say that the level of frustration about trolling is because the game advertises a semblance of agency and control over your team and people are being denied this.

What do you mean by: "the game never simulates in a direct 1vs1 way,, but in a individual and spared system." Are you positing that each team plays essentially against itself and then the results are compared?

The only thing that the game misses now, are limits of avq, as we had before, that were comprehensible. We knew time ago that having a 5* market, and a margin in what was so difficult to lose vs a -30% team, that this helped managers to know the distance they needed to train a team to almost guarantee a win, now the margin is more much higher, and this creates frustration to new players cause they don't know what they should do.

[Lucian1986]

it's not a slot machine, it's backgammon.
If it was a slot machine i wouldn't have 132 1st cups and you wouldn't have those

Backgammon is a game of skill. If Top Eleven were a game of skill, my abandoned team wouldn't have 33 wins and only 2 defeats this season.... but it does.... so zero skills involved in an abandoned team yet, at lvl 8, it has 5 Leagues won, 2 Cups and 2 Champions Leagues. Or is your argument that most players are less skilled than an abandoned team?

Also, apart from 6 defeats, every one of those defeats felt like I was cheated.

[Lucian1986]

Khris, it isn't just about differences in quality!

It is about the fact that sometimes, you can very clearly tell that your team is playing at half strength. Whereas your team performed solidly all season, suddenly, against a relatively weak team, your team can't seem to make more than 2 passes without losing the ball while your GK's rating falls to 5 after 10 min or you get 3 goals scored against you in 10 min. Few people are coming on here and complaining that in a tough fought battle, the opponent got lucky on a counter and scored the goal of the game. They are complaining because they either dominate the opponent and still lose or their team fell apart against a team that should have been a minor inconvenience.

Also, getting from 85% to 110% isn't easy. It requires a lot of work. When you see your team lose sporadically to much weaker teams and abandoned teams outperform, it doesn't feel like skills are involved.