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Thread: Formations after UPDATE

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k1tb Formations after UPDATE 11-18-2017, 07:04 PM
Toxcatl People say 3w-dmc-*... 11-18-2017, 09:48 PM
Toxcatl By 4-3-3 I meant DL-DC-DC-DR... 11-19-2017, 10:43 PM
sling I am confused by the position... 11-20-2017, 04:16 PM
ibangali interesting, you mean you... 11-21-2017, 05:09 AM
Toxcatl As I said, my MR and ML both... 11-21-2017, 11:08 AM
Javert89 As suspected before season... 11-19-2017, 12:28 PM
Cedric This is going to be my third... 11-19-2017, 01:20 PM
k1tb Many have said, that... 11-19-2017, 03:14 PM
Kaizer Franz Nothing has change ,... 11-19-2017, 11:55 PM
gizzmo C'est quoi qui va mal dans ta... 11-20-2017, 09:27 AM
Kaizer Franz Tu vois de la haine partout ,... 11-20-2017, 12:36 PM
Ποσιδονας I believe it changed. Those... 11-20-2017, 06:46 AM
Toxcatl Guys, can you please use... 11-20-2017, 03:27 PM
Kaizer Franz Take care of your a** , i... 11-20-2017, 08:27 PM
nikolgiorgos he is right there is a... 11-20-2017, 08:41 PM
ibangali Cool, sound like its 4-3-2w-1... 11-21-2017, 03:52 PM
Toxcatl If you wish =] 90916 11-21-2017, 06:29 PM
ibangali thanks for the screenshot. On... 11-21-2017, 06:34 PM
Toxcatl I honestly don't know. I... 11-21-2017, 10:24 PM
Toxcatl Ok, today I almost got ripped... 11-22-2017, 07:28 PM
pcmacdaniel I had a good long... 11-23-2017, 02:01 AM
Jean.Monico Humm. Good point. What... 11-23-2017, 01:12 PM
pcmacdaniel depends on the opponent. ... 11-23-2017, 09:49 PM
Jean.Monico I gotta agree with you. I... 11-23-2017, 01:09 PM
Toxcatl I'm confused, have you mixed... 11-23-2017, 02:59 PM
pcmacdaniel Just seeing this, sorry. ... 11-24-2017, 05:14 PM
Jean.Monico Humm. On paper, gegenpressure... 11-24-2017, 05:43 PM
pcmacdaniel Agreed, it would be nice to... 11-24-2017, 06:45 PM
mikebokoyo1googlemail.com This update... I've lost... 11-22-2017, 02:14 PM
Toxcatl I'd like to play friendlies... 11-23-2017, 09:36 AM
Jean.Monico ;P I'll make it shorter. I... 11-23-2017, 03:34 PM
k1tb 4-5-1 V style is working... 11-26-2017, 08:14 AM
pcmacdaniel Regarding 4-5-1v style, in... 11-27-2017, 01:36 AM
Toxcatl Today I played three games... 11-26-2017, 11:08 PM
Jean.Monico Did you notice any strange... 11-27-2017, 03:27 PM
Toxcatl No, I haven't. Some games are... 11-27-2017, 03:52 PM
Toxcatl *Bzzzzz...* 11-27-2017, 08:27 AM
Ποσιδονας @Toxcatl In your pic, your... 11-27-2017, 08:37 AM
Toxcatl That's because I'm facing a... 11-27-2017, 09:22 AM
CMA FC I have thought about the... 11-27-2017, 11:17 AM
Toxcatl I have no idea tbh. It is... 11-27-2017, 12:12 PM
Willyw Same like toxcatl, if i have... 11-28-2017, 11:49 PM
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  1. #1
    Apprentice Jean.Monico's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxcatl View Post
    I suspected before that High pressing works good against Long passes, and m2m against Short, and I think it's true. I am not 100% sure, of course.
    I gotta agree with you.
    I have been testing it since 2nd half of last season. I was really sure that high pressure works better against short passes and worse against long passes. I left my team playing high pressure for all those matches and my "easier wins" were against opponents who plays long/mixed passes (where their passes rate were below 85%). Against short, I had problems.

    Ofcourse, Top11 developers may have based the game maths in some real football theories. So this "high-pressure" we have here could be something related to what they call "Gegenpressure". Tactical Theory: Counter- or Gegenpressing | Spielverlagerung.com
    This theory is about your whole team pressing the opponent once possession is lost (for some defined 5-10 secs) so you don't give to the opponent time to aim (and think) for a counterattack, so, on paper, it would work fine against opponents playing counterattacks and long passes.

    Changing subject (but not changing it at all), did you watch yesterday's match between Gremio(BR) and Lanus(ARG) for Copa Libertadores de América final?
    It was something like Gremio on 4-2-3-1, very offensive and tons of pressure, and Lanús really patient on 4-5-1V with short passes (a lot of balls gone back to the goalkeeper and he never tried a long pass). Seemed Lanús short passes worked really fine against the pressure (but Gremio won the match at the end).
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  2. #2
    Famous Toxcatl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jean.Monico View Post
    I gotta agree with you.
    I have been testing it since 2nd half of last season. I was really sure that high pressure works better against short passes and worse against long passes.
    I'm confused, have you mixed them here? =]
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jean.Monico View Post
    I gotta agree with you.
    I have been testing it since 2nd half of last season. I was really sure that high pressure works better against short passes and worse against long passes. I left my team playing high pressure for all those matches and my "easier wins" were against opponents who plays long/mixed passes (where their passes rate were below 85%). Against short, I had problems.

    Ofcourse, Top11 developers may have based the game maths in some real football theories. So this "high-pressure" we have here could be something related to what they call "Gegenpressure". Tactical Theory: Counter- or Gegenpressing | Spielverlagerung.com
    This theory is about your whole team pressing the opponent once possession is lost (for some defined 5-10 secs) so you don't give to the opponent time to aim (and think) for a counterattack, so, on paper, it would work fine against opponents playing counterattacks and long passes.

    Changing subject (but not changing it at all), did you watch yesterday's match between Gremio(BR) and Lanus(ARG) for Copa Libertadores de América final?
    It was something like Gremio on 4-2-3-1, very offensive and tons of pressure, and Lanús really patient on 4-5-1V with short passes (a lot of balls gone back to the goalkeeper and he never tried a long pass). Seemed Lanús short passes worked really fine against the pressure (but Gremio won the match at the end).
    Just seeing this, sorry.

    The Gen-Gen press can be effective in this game. I learned it from an association teammate earlier this year, and it's been great at times. I changed to it last season in my CL final when trailing 1-3. Substitution to change the system was made at the 51st minute. 20 minutes later, I had a 6-3 lead. When it works, it's absolutely amazing. It's risky though.

    Some things that are important w/ the gen-gen press in this game.

    1. You need the players to run it properly. Speed and Fitness seem most important. For defenders to track back and midfielders to close down passing lanes I would think.

    2. It seems more vulnerable to long passes than mixed or short passes. Probably because something like a 3-1-2-3-1 gen-gen press has so many bodies in the middle that passing short is a challenge. Not entire sure though, but it seems to be eating up short passing games when I use it. By same tokens, not many bodies at the back to defend against the long passes.

    It is a great system to know though since when the opponent is vulnerable to it, it can be utterly dominating.
    Last edited by pcmacdaniel; 11-24-2017 at 05:25 PM.
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  4. #4
    Apprentice Jean.Monico's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcmacdaniel View Post
    It seems more vulnerable to long passes than mixed or short passes.
    It is a great system to know though since when the opponent is vulnerable to it, it can be utterly dominating.
    Humm. On paper, gegenpressure is used to break the efficiency of Long passes and avoid counter-attacks - you press the opponent, so he has no time to aim for the long pass, and when he tries it, it's like he just gets rid of the ball and your defense gets it easily.
    And, again on paper, it should be vulnerable to Short passes - your players running insanely to get the ball, but the opponent doesn't even try hard and pass the ball to a close colleague (when thinking a lot is not necessary).

    Anyway, it's a just a theory that, in the real field, might work or not. And I wish I knew how it's designed in top11 so we could use it properly ;/
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    Agreed, it would be nice to get more insight.

    I've heard multiple theories, but everyone has a different one and they contradict each other and what not. I've heard the passing/marking one mentioned hear by toxcatl. I've heard another theory where their the relationship is between mentality/passing, and the four with only two options have no relationship to anything with a normal or mixed option (it's based on no mixed/normal option for some orders but not others; would this be a problem for someone writing code for the game engine?). I've heard another that its all semantics.
    Last edited by pcmacdaniel; 11-24-2017 at 09:29 PM.
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